The former deputy Julio Borges He is one of the most prominent figures of the opposition Venezuela in exile. He currently lives in Spain, but has closely followed the recent campaign in which Edmundo Gonzalez will face Nicolas Maduro in the presidential elections on July 28. In conversation with EL TIEMPO he revealed, among other things, what proposals have been presented to Chavismo to accept a democratic transition in the country.
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One week before the presidential elections in Venezuela, what does the accusation made by María Corina Machado regarding the attempted assassination of her mean?
First of all, it is scary and painful for Maria Corina. But it must also be seen as a regime that is desperate. All the polls that have been done – foreign and local – are consistent in that the difference is between 25 and 30 points (in favor of the opposition). Therefore, Nicolas Maduro knows that the only thing left for him is brute force and he resorts to this type of thing, such as the arrest of leaders and members of the campaign, to try to intimidate Maria Corina. The reaction of the people, which is the important thing, is the opposite. Venezuelans stand up, rebel and are eager to go out and vote.
Julio Borges.
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Were you able to speak to María Corina after that episode?
I was able to speak with María Corina and she has shown that she has a lot of strength in all the challenges she has had to face. What she often says is that a spiritual struggle is taking place in Venezuela. This means that a kind of battle of David against Goliath is taking place because they are facing a power that has all the violence, laws and repression. However, fighting for the right ideals gives María Corina, Edmundo González and the Venezuelan people the strength to continue forward.
We recently heard statements from Nicolás Maduro saying that if the government does not win, violence could break out in the country. How far can the government go from threatening to actually doing something?
What has happened to Maduro is that they themselves have been making mistakes. Dictatorships often collapse and fracture for that very reason. Since the presidential primaries of October 22, 2023, the regime lost the initiative. At that time, María Corina Machado took off with a force that has been growing, and Maduro does not have the capacity to have a credible discourse. All his events are sad, unpopulated and absolutely bureaucratic. They are on a blind alley, desperate and, therefore, it is very dangerous. That is the reality.
But how far can they go?
I trust that there is a small ray of common sense in those who currently have the power of the dictatorship in Venezuela and, above all, in the case of the Armed Forces that they will respect the vote of the people, which is sacred. We are right in that question, whether they will be willing and willing to see a change.
How can we get Venezuelans to actually go to the polls on July 28?
If one looks at the electoral polls as a film, and not as a snapshot of a particular moment, what we see is that from the beginning of the year until now there are several things that have been changing. One of them is that when people were asked who was going to win, many people said Maduro, even if they were going to vote for the opposition. And that has changed completely: now people say: “I am going to vote for the opposition and Edmundo and María Corina Machado are going to win.” In other words, the perception of the all-powerful Maduro has been changing radically. At first, everyone was very fearful and hesitant to vote. Today, the Venezuelan population that wants to go to the polls has been increasing. I believe that there are some emotional changes, a change in spirit and atmosphere that is being experienced in Venezuela. Even in the international community it was viewed with a lot of skepticism, but everyone is again very attentive to what is happening in our country.
Nicolas Maduro, Edmundo Gonzalez and Maria Corina Machado.
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Speaking of the international community, at the beginning we saw enthusiasm from Colombia and Brazil to push for an agreement on guarantees for the elections. We saw that this stopped and that Maduro did not accept any agreement. Beyond the pressure that the United States is exerting, what are other international actors doing?
There is a very clear energy and direction to support the vote, democracy and political change in the country. For example, the fact that Brazil has said that it will bring electoral observers, despite the fact that Lula has his ideological quadrant, shows that he wants to support democracy in the country. We hope that this force implies that this group of observers will not simply be onlookers. Another important issue is the change that has taken place in the European Union. The new head of diplomacy of the bloc is Kaja Kallas, a young person who has an important history of fighting against communism. And of course, in the United States it is important to take advantage of the electoral campaign to create pressure and for Maduro to feel that he cannot do whatever he wants.
And in the case of Colombia?
Colombia started with this proposal for a referendum to reach an agreement. Maduro rejected it and we understand that at this moment the foreign minister is proposing a kind of new draft. I understand that no one has seen it, but there is the perspective of seeing what that paper that would be put on the table means. If that means respecting the rules of the game, seeking a democratic transition in the country and voting on equal terms, then that is welcome.
What can the world abstain from if Nicolás Maduro, regardless of the method, remains in power?
All the most serious publications in the world, such as The New York Times, The Washington Post and The Economist magazine, say that Maduro has two options: accept that he lost or commit fraud. What I want to convey is that there is no way in which Maduro can perform a miracle to win. What we expect from the international community is that there are no half measures. These remaining days before the election should be of enormous pressure on Maduro, but also on the Armed Forces and the electoral referee to be part of this change. The future of democracy and the future of freedom in the region depends on political change in Venezuela.
It is estimated that at least 200,000 Venezuelans are eligible to vote abroad. How are they organizing themselves?
This point is important to make known. Being conservative, close to three million Venezuelans have the right to vote abroad. It is a huge number. If you add them up, it is much more than any state in the country. That is, there are more Venezuelans abroad than in any region of Venezuela. But it is honestly a shame how the dictatorship closes the doors to Venezuelans. Knowing that there are at least three million voters, only a few were allowed the right to register. However, the question is important because people are excited, the different social and political movements are organizing themselves so that the world pays attention to the Venezuelan issue.
Nicolás Maduro’s statement was in his speech in Caracas.
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What incentive do you think can be given to Maduro to agree to negotiations and accept defeat, should it happen next Sunday?
I know that Maduro has been given all the alternatives on the table. He has been offered elections in which he will run, others in which he will not run, or, for example, to choose a country in the world to go there with all the guarantees. He has also been offered to remove any type of legal or political persecution. And to the extent that he has refused, he is burying himself because the proceedings in the International Criminal Court are advancing, which are not subject to negotiation. He is the one who has chosen this path of closing the democratic avenues of the country.
Beneath Maduro there is also a structure that has a lot of power. Have these incentives that have been offered to Nicolás Maduro included, for example, Diosdado Cabello or the Rodríguez brothers?
Dictatorships, if you study them, end up collapsing because they start to fracture. If you remove bricks from a building, when you least expect it, it collapses. Right now there are many people in Maduro’s circle who are absolutely desperate to make contact with the democratic alternative because they know that the possibility of a change in the country is imminent. The interesting thing about these processes, like when the Berlin Wall fell, is that everyone thought it was impossible, but one day it collapsed in seconds. That’s how dictatorships are, they seem like enormous, all-powerful, violent giants, like a dragon, and in seconds they collapse. That’s what’s happening in Venezuela.
Maria Corina Machado.
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The day after, July 29, what do you think is next for Venezuela?
I think that the 29th will obviously depend on what happens on the 28th. The bet is that the facts will prevail. I remember the film ‘No’ a lot, about the plebiscite in Chile. There, Pinochet also tried to do everything to win the vote. In one scene, a soldier arrives at the Palacio de la Moneda – which is as if he arrived at Miraflores, in Venezuela – and people were biting their nails because they knew nothing about the results. That soldier is taken by surprise and told: “it seems that the no won.” In other words, the democratic opposition won in Chile. And, again, like the Berlin Wall, that single declaration brought down the entire Pinochet regime. If that happens, on the 29th a process of transition to democracy can begin, of returning to the country.
Are you going to return to Venezuela if that happens?
Obviously, I want to return to Venezuela. I want my children to grow up in Venezuela. There is no bigger dream than for my children to stop being uprooted. We were in Colombia. Right now we are in Spain, but I want them to be Venezuelans with roots in Venezuela like a good part of those eight million people who were forced to leave. The important thing is to have that opportunity to return and rebuild the country.
Ana Rodriguez Brazon – Correspondent of El Tiempo – Caracas
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