Jens Spahn warns of China: “In many areas we can and must become more independent,” says the former health minister in an interview with the Munich newspaper Merkur.
Munich – For a while, Jens Spahn was considered a possible successor to Angela Merkel. But Corona, Armin Laschet and buying a house put a spoke in his wheel. Now the still only 42-year-old has to queue at the back. However, the CDU parliamentary group leader has retained a clear opinion. a conversation
Mr. Spahn, a year ago the chancellor gave his speech about turning the tide. One million Ukrainians were admitted. Battle tanks are delivered, the Bundeswehr is upgraded. Will the traffic light clear away the rubble of Merkel’s policy?
No, Olaf Scholz is clearing away the rubble of his own politics. I experienced it myself at the cabinet table: Finance Minister Scholz rejected every million more for the Bundeswehr and every armed drone. It was a real political fight. Sigmar Gabriel even claimed in his speeches that I wanted to cut pensions in order to buy tanks. At this level, the SPD has created anti-Bundeswehr sentiment.
You don’t want to say that Angela Merkel just couldn’t prevail against Scholz.
In hindsight, we should have uncompromisingly made the strengthening of the Bundeswehr a coalition issue. In any case, the two percent target was only in our election program.
So now the turning point. . .
. . . and I was one of the Union MPs who stood up and clapped after Scholz’s speech. I still remember how irritated some colleagues looked at me. Only: Little has happened since then. Almost none of the 100 billion euros has been spent, and not a single cartridge has been ordered.
But the new minister seems to be blowing a new wind.
Boris Pistorius is off to a good start. It is important for the soldiers to have a minister they can respect. But he too is measured by what really happens.
He is currently busy collecting tanks from all over Europe because the allies suddenly no longer remember any commitments. Was Berlin tricked?
If Olaf Scholz had led from the start, completely different alliances would have been possible. You can hear that around the security conference and everywhere in Brussels: There is widespread mistrust of Germany. I find that fatal. The unclear communication, all the hesitation and procrastination towards allies is just devastating.
“Angela Merkel has never had any illusions about who Vladimir Putin is”
But at least Scholz manages to take the war-skeptical part of the population with him.
Caution! Nobody in Germany and Europe wants this war. But it’s about stopping Vladimir Putin. He clearly said that he will not stop with Ukraine. His logic is: where there are Russians, there is Russia.
The SPD has announced that it will review its image of Russia and the mistakes of the past. We hear nothing from the Union.
There is one difference: parts of the SPD were corrupted by Russia. First and foremost Gerhard Schröder, but also the whole Lower Saxony-Russia connection behind it. Angela Merkel has never had any illusions about who Vladimir Putin is. In the end, the politics of integration was wrong – but that is something different than pandering to the SPD.
But now you talk yourself into Merkel’s policy very nicely.
We should have named the threat to Putin more clearly. One lesson is: We need deterrence again. As in the old Latin proverb: if you want peace, prepare for war.
“Where are we too dependent on China? What happens in a Taiwan conflict?”
What are the lessons from all of this for China policy?
You can learn something from the war, but also from the pandemic: For two decades, Europe, the USA and China were on the way to a world of free trade based on the division of labour. You have relied on each other. That no longer worked well during the pandemic. Germany – both the government and its companies – must do a China stress test: Where are we too dependent on China? What happens in a Taiwan conflict? In some fields – rare earths, certain technologies – we have so far hardly had any alternatives. In many areas we can and must become more independent.
Do you think that the message has already arrived everywhere in business – for example in the car industry?
No, it hasn’t gotten everywhere yet. Nor is it about total detachment. With over a billion people, China is a large, growing market. But we must identify and reduce risks. Every company has to check this for itself – by the way, so that they don’t have to call on the state later if they get into trouble with sanctions.
In 2015/16 you criticized Angela Merkel’s refugee policy. Now mayors are calling for help again. Are politicians about to break their promise that 2015 will not be allowed to repeat itself?
However. The federal government is in the process of breaking the promise. This week’s picture alone: the refugee summit is taking place in Berlin, but the chancellor is visiting a bakery in Hanover. That was a fatal signal to the many district administrators and helpers on site, who sleep badly because they no longer know how to do it on site. The situation is now almost more difficult than it was in 2015.
That means?
There are limits to what a society can achieve as integration. We have to say what is: We don’t do justice to the people, integration only succeeds in everyday life or not at all. But daycare centers, schools, apartments, with psychological care, we are at the limit everywhere, more is just not possible right now. I also say that with regard to Brokstedt’s knife attack.
What do you mean?
Unfortunately, with an increasing number of people – especially young men – who have fled, experienced violence, are uprooted and homeless, the risk of this happening is increasing. You need intensive psychological support, which we cannot provide on this scale. We finally have to talk openly about this – and draw the necessary conclusions.
Interview: Georg Anastasiadis and Mike Schier
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