In an interview with the Münchner Merkur, Friedrich Merz talks about the AfD, the chancellor question in the Union and CSU boss Markus Söder.
Munich – Will this be the year the government falls? And Friedrich Merz will become chancellor? The CDU chairman reacts rather cautiously to this question. No, says Merz, he doesn't expect new elections to take place quickly. At the beginning of the year we arranged to meet the party and parliamentary group leader via video conference. The 68-year-old from Sauerland has spent the last few days in his holiday home on Lake Tegernsee and appears concentrated and thoughtful. The interview is interrupted just once: the doorbell rings, it's the star singers, carrying their blessing from house to house. He takes a few minutes for her. With a blessing, the conversation then continues seamlessly.
We're starting in 2024. What is your good resolution for the new year – other than becoming chancellor?
(laughs) That's probably not going to happen this year. In my opinion, we will not have new elections, even if they are urgently needed. My personal resolution: I want to continue working politically, stay healthy throughout the year and do a little more exercise.
Merz deals against Esken and Klingbeil – “What’s going on in these people’s heads?”
SPD leader Saskia Esken wants you to stop speaking in such an “incendiary manner” in the future.
Do I have to comment on this? And Mr. Klingbeil uses the same term in the direction of the AfD, certainly not by chance. When Mr. Klingbeil and Ms. Esken repeatedly lump the CDU and AfD together, then every sensible person asks themselves: What is going on in these people's heads?
Well, she probably means sentences like those of the “little pashas” in the integration debate.
Many people have told me that that was a euphemistic description. We were able to see again at the turn of the year how big the real integration problems are in Germany.
You didn't spend New Year's Eve in Berlin. Everyone is now relieved that there were “only” 390 arrests. You too?
In Berlin it became clear that it does make a difference who is in power: the red-red-green Senate had completely lost control last year, and under the leadership of the CDU, the crackdown has now been noticeably tougher. If there are around 400 arrests and riots again, I wouldn't call it a “success”. We must not get used to something like this happening. But at least the direction in Berlin is right.
AfD at poll high: Merz sees growing dissatisfaction with the federal government
The new year starts with a survey banger. 37 percent for the AfD in Saxony. Is there a risk of landslides in the east this year?
These are snapshots that show, above all, growing dissatisfaction with the federal government, and not just in the East. If the three traffic light parties together only get 11 percent in surveys in Saxony and the SPD only gets three, then that is a clear call to solve the problems that are well known.
Your problem is: Without the Left Party, a CDU Prime Minister cannot be elected in Saxony or Thuringia. If the firewall is on the right, will the CDU tear down the one on the left? Or to Wagenknecht and her Putin fans?
Polls are not election results. We don't look to the right and left, but rather focus on “pure CDU”. I still believe that the CDU has the chance to become the strongest force in Saxony, Thuringia and Brandenburg. Election campaigns are also there to change the mood and convince people.
We cannot share your calmness. The polls are disastrous, there is no indication that the CDU will come in first place in any country!
You confuse calmness with concentration on the big issues. We have an integration problem, a massive immigration problem and significant economic concerns – and at the same time a federal government that is apparently completely overwhelmed by the tasks it is tasked with. That's what I'm thinking about, not coalitions.
Merz speaks out against AfD ban – “grist for the mill”
Esken has a suggestion. She is again calling for a ban on the AfD. Would you like to help her with this?
This leaves me somewhat stunned. Such sham debates are grist for the AfD's mill. Has Ms. Esken forgotten how the NPD ban proceedings ended? And does the SPD leader seriously believe that a party that gets close to 30 percent in surveys can simply be banned? This is a frightening repression of reality. The only effective concept is: Politicians must find sensible solutions to the problems, then the AfD will also become smaller again. Anything else would be a declaration of bankruptcy. Does Ms. Esken also want to ban the Union if we point out the problems that the SPD is not so comfortable with?
The funeral service for your friend Wolfgang Schäuble is taking place today. What did you personally learn from him?
The absolute obligation to be confident. That one must not become fatalistic or cynical in politics.
Merz calls for cruise missiles for Ukraine – “too late and too little help”
This is not easy at the moment. 2024 begins with huge foreign policy challenges. In the east, Ukraine is reeling under Putin's increasingly violent bombings, and in the west there is a threat of a new President Trump. Is Germany sufficiently prepared for the new world situation?
We saw unprecedented attacks by the Russian army against civilian targets in Ukraine over the holidays and New Year – egregious war crimes. Inner cities, hospitals, schools and the energy supply are systematically bombed. Families in Ukraine die every day from Russian weapons. This is unbearable. But there is hardly any “world conscience” against it. This confirms my opinion: Germany and Europe must put themselves in a much better position to resist such attacks on our freedom. And so far we have simply helped Ukraine too late and too little.
What specifically needs to be done for Ukraine now?
Germany should finally deliver cruise missiles that can also reach the supply routes to Crimea. Much of the war against Ukraine is being waged from Crimea; the Russians are sending troops and weapons from there. And a new joint effort is needed across Europe to continue to help Ukraine politically, financially and militarily in 2024.
The danger of war will probably remain for a longer period of time. Does Germany need conscription again?
In any case, the suspension of compulsory military service in 2011 was a mistake. But you can't just reintroduce them overnight. In the CDU we have passed a party conference resolution for a mandatory year of membership. And I have great sympathy for the Federal Defense Minister's suggestion that, as in Sweden, all young people in a year should first be screened, both men and women, and then make some of them an offer to join the armed forces. Yes: We have to talk again about social obligations in our country.
CDU leader Merz wants to “reorganize” aid for Ukrainian refugees
And what can Berlin do to ensure that fewer men desert to Germany, as the Ukrainian government wants? And for young men to return?
We should reorganize our aid to Ukrainian refugees. It's also about the level of performance. Those who are here also need to be placed into the job market much more quickly. Other countries have obviously done this better than we have. We have to say to the refugees: You have to help yourself so that we can continue to support you here to this extent. Going to work is an important part of participation and personal responsibility.
Again: Send young men back?
This is an issue and the Federal Government needs to talk to Ukraine about it in the next few weeks.
Things are also going badly in terms of economic policy; we are at the bottom of the list in terms of growth in Europe. Does the sentence with which Stoiber went into the federal election in 2002 apply again: Germany is a case of restructuring?
In any case, this is a finding that will emerge in 2024. For example, we all underestimate the high capital outflows from Germany. Our country has been losing economic substance for years. If we have 2.7 million unemployed people and 760,000 vacancies at the same time, then something is wrong in our labor market. This year we should come together to send a message: Our prosperity and social security can only be maintained in the long term with more work and greater effort.
Merz on the K question in the Union – the decision should be made in late summer 2024
At the CSU retreat in Seeon, you leave the stage to your colleague Markus Söder and stay away. Why?
I've been to the last three CSU exams, but unfortunately I can't this time, and there's a very simple, personal reason for that: my father is turning 100 this weekend. The whole family is visiting. The family comes first this year.
Söder is in no hurry to proclaim you as candidate for chancellor. He says that if you take a penalty too early, you'll miss…
That is our common view. That's why we'll make a decision in late summer 2024.
It's strange that some prime ministers from the CDU are already making their preferences known…
What's strange about that? It is completely normal that such an important personnel decision is discussed and that there are questions about it in the media. We would have to be seriously worried if no one asked which of us should become Chancellor next year. We as a Union are in as good a position as the three traffic light parties put together. And of course the expectations of us increase.
If you were chancellor, would you like to have Markus Söder as super minister in your cabinet?
Markus Söder is doing his job as Prime Minister of Bavaria really well. That's how voters see it, and I share that assessment.
You would be 69 in the next election. Do you understand that some people say: Merz has grown up a bit to be chancellor for many more years?
Thanks for the kind wording. I feel fit and productive.
“Generation Z” would still have a few other life plans than working hard at 69. No desire for work-life balance, Mr. Merz?
I don't think so. For all of us in the country, we have to work a little harder for our freedom and prosperity, and I try to set a good example.
Interview: Georg Anastasiadis, Mike Schier, Christian Deutschländer
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