Spied on and monitored, the dossier case is something more than an anomaly
The fear of hidden directors, citizens being spied on, thousands of accesses that shouldn't have happened: the dossier case. Italian Business heard on the subject from the deputy prosecutor of the Court of Appeal of Milan Cuno Tarfusser, former vice-president of the International Criminal Court in The Hague, former chief prosecutor in Bolzano. A long career of him, whose reorganization model to Bolzano is become “best practice project” dAndthe Ministry of Justice and implemented in over 190 judicial offices in Italy. It is the magistrate who asked for the review of the trial on the Erba massacre
Dossier story. Who can be the instigator? Or the instigators?
In my opinion there can only be three hypotheses. The first is a question of money, but I don't think so given that, from what we learn, there doesn't seem to be an economic advantage for those who operated. The other two hypotheses require a premise, namely that a Judicial Police officer placed in a Prosecutor's Office necessarily has two masters, his police force of origin and the magistrates of the Prosecutor's Office, in this case the DNA. Therefore, since it is difficult to be faithful to two wives, logic dictates that the instigator or instigators are to be found in one of the two structures. I don't see many other solutions.
But isn't one of these wives faithful to someone else? Is there a third master who dominates everything?
All can be. This, however, is the next step, that is, what do I do with the data I have. The real heritage is there.
I ask more explicitly: could there be parts of the Services or deviant environments involved?
Well, the deviation already lies in this first step, i.e. illegal access to sensitive data. The illegal use of this data by the first sender or the subsequent one to whom the data is transferred is nothing other than a terrible “qualitative leap” of the deviation. What is certain is that the servant of the State who commits a crime does something deviant simply because he has sworn loyalty to the State.
You have 40 years of experience in the judiciary, what kind of story does this sound like to you?
All sorts of things have happened in Italy. We can say that deviating from one's duties is a behavior that has a certain tradition… and therefore the story, now in the limelight, pains me but does not surprise me at all, unfortunately.
Hypothesizing, given how the story is evolving, could external instigators be so powerful as to guarantee “coverage”, i.e. that the story doesn't land anywhere? It's just a hypothesis of course.
At present, however, it is only speculation and I don't want to speculate.
Have you met Laudati?
I met Antonio Laudati several years ago, because we were on some mission abroad together. I have always had and have a good impression of him, of a serious and very intelligent person. Of course, I was a little surprised to read that he didn't want to be questioned only to then release a note through his lawyers in which he makes statements, in which he declares himself unrelated to the dossier affair. I have no reason to doubt him and I hope for him that he is able to explain the facts, but I also think that a magistrate has a greater responsibility than an ordinary citizen before the law and what he declared to the press he could also have said to the magistrates on the record, no?
In various interviews given, second lieutenant Striano says that he was instructed by superiors. But it seems strange to me that a DNA officer could carry out an anti-mafia investigation on Fedez?
In fact Fedez and Antimafia, but also others whose names have appeared in the press are difficult to connect to mafia investigations. Let's say that it is clear that there is something not right. However, in my opinion, it is unthinkable that an institutional figure, such as Striano certainly is, does all this for fun, out of curiosity, just because he has the credentials to do the access.
In your opinion, beyond the will and determination of magistrate Raffaele Cantone, will the investigation be reached? I ask this because many experts or people involved on the sidelines, to whom I ask for an interview, are deeply disillusioned and react by saying: stories like this, as always happens in Italy, never get anywhere…
Well I join the many disillusioned people even if, as a man of the institutions, I can't help but still have a little faith. What is certain, however, is that all those who are at the head of judicial offices, of all judicial offices, are also an expression, not of merit, not of aptitude, not of ability, but primarily of judicial power.
Explain to us better
I distinguish, on the one hand, the judiciary or the magistrates who are an expression of our society and just as in society there are good, serious, respectable, hard-working, intelligent, etc. people, but also those who are not, the same goes for the magistrates. But this is physiological and there is nothing strange. On the other hand, however, there is the judicial power which conditions and guides through the heads of the offices which it chooses based on affiliation, certainly not on skill. Here, the judicial power is in the hands, it is dominated by the four entities that are called “currents”. But this seems like a well-known fact to me, right?
Yes
Now, since my mother always told me to stay away from drafts, that you catch colds (laughs), I have always followed this advice. There is no doubt that these four currents do everything. Any head of the office is an expression of one of these four currents, but so are the magistrates in the ministries, as are those of the School of the Judiciary. Here, any appointment of the CSM is a replica of the same scheme. Cencelli was an amateur in comparison. If you are not part of the system, you are excluded.
You were head of an office though
Yes, but I am the classic mistake, the perfect example of how not to be an office manager and in fact, since I did well, I was first sent abroad and once I returned I was no longer taken into consideration for a other assignment. Too independent, too unpredictable, too unreliable. But that's okay, I made my career, independently of them and I'm proud of it. Of course, I can say that in no other judicial system that I know of, office heads are made like in Italy.
Why do you tell us all this about the dossier affair?
I say this because the problem is in balance and freedom. In Anglo-Saxon systems, every power corresponds to a severe control mechanism. We let powers grow uncontrollably and then we are surprised if they overflow. Here lies the problem, or rather, one of many problemsthe.
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